A Conversation for Homer's Odyssey
holl (Nil Illigitaemus Carborundum) *you dont fool the hool* berty and olly: the mad raving booty shakers (oooaaa oooaaa) Started conversation Aug 12, 2003
forgive me if im wrong, but, isnt athena HELPING odyseus? when has athena, goddess of war and wisdom, been an evil "capricious woman"?
anhaga Posted Aug 13, 2003
I hesitate to get involved in this entry again, but I must agree with you. While Athena is,perhaps, capricious at times, I think it is an extreme stretch to suggest that she should ever be seen as evil. In fact, I don't really think that Calypso and Circe should be described as evil.
If you have a look at some of the threads attached to this entry, you'll see that I've already had some involvement with it concerning one very narrow difficulty. Perhaps you'd like to take the problem of Athena's "evil" with the editors at Editorial Feedback A388334 .
Tom-the-flip-side Posted Aug 28, 2003
I too would have to agree.
I never, in my study of the bok, felt of athena as 'evil'.
I don't want to stir things up but I'm not sure these were my words
anhaga Posted Aug 28, 2003
I just looked through your unedited version again Tom, and they most decidedly are not your words. You wrote quite the opposite of Athena. I'm sure I didn't do this evil Athena bit, either. Ismarah?
i would like to apologise
i just re-read your article, and i obviously made a mistake as to your saying athena was evil
it was merely "capricious" and the evil was directed towards the suitors
anhaga Posted Aug 29, 2003
Actually, Holl, the edited entry pretty clearly says that the various capricious women are forms of evil. It really should be corrected.
i suppose...i had forgotten how hard it is to get out of an argument with us h2g2 people...hehehe
ismarah - fuelled by M&Ms Posted Dec 1, 2003
Anhaga - you have to remember that this is subbed in BE, not AE. If I had put in a comma before the word 'and' in the sentence referred to, it should in BE be read as 'and, and'.
Sorry for being late to the discussion - moving overseas kind of does that to you...
I'll just go back to my more normal (of late) off line state...
anhaga Posted Dec 2, 2003
hmm. I see now the intention of the sentence and I think I won't argue BE vs AE usage just now (In CE, there should be a comma). I do, however, find the sentence to be confusing and unclear. It just seems that some sort of mid-Atlantic comma would clarify things.
anhaga Posted Dec 2, 2003
No no no! Hold on a minute. I've just been looking at the sentence again and never mind the commas:
'We also have evil, in the shape of the suitors and various capricious women, such as Circe, Calypso and Athena, over which 'good' is trying to conquer.'
What is good trying to conquer? Is good trying to conquer evil? evil in the shape of the suitors? What are the various capricious women doing? If good is not trying to conquer them (is 'over' really the preposition you want? do you really need a preposition?) then what are the women doing in the sentence? Are they just being capricious? If they are somethings that good is trying to conquer, then are they not logically evil? If so, then we get back to the original question of the thread: Athena? Evil?
Is the sentence really trying to say 'we also have evil, in the shape of the suitors. And we also have various capricious women, such as Circe, Calyupso and Athena.' and then a bit of a dangling logical fragment 'over which 'good' is trying to conquer.'?
I really think the sentence is having trouble. Unless part of the point is, in fact, the suggestion that Athena is evil. If so, then the sentence is simply inaccurate.
Tom-the-flip-side Posted Dec 2, 2003
My GOD! It does sound like it is saying she is evil!!!
ALL HANDS ON DECK
Change it! Change it before the minds of countless people are damaged.
Or alternativly do it in your own time.
ITIWBS Posted Oct 24, 2008
Taking a syncretic view, many of the tales of the contests between the Babylonian deities Tiamat and Marduk are substantially the same stories as those of the contests between Athena and Poseidon, which makes Tiamat and Marduk cognates of Athena and Poseidon. Similarly, the Hindu tale of the founding of the city of Calcutta is substantially the same story as that of the terminal contest between Tiamat and Marduk, in turn making Kali and Visnu cognates of Tiamat/Athena, Marduk/Poseidon.
...Joseph Campbell once wrote a book relating on the theme of the futility of tracing any classical myth to an ultimate source, which he titled "The Flight of the Wild Gander"...
Key: Complain about this post
- 1: holl (Nil Illigitaemus Carborundum) *you dont fool the hool* berty and olly: the mad raving booty shakers (oooaaa oooaaa) (Aug 12, 2003)
- 2: anhaga (Aug 13, 2003)
- 3: Tom-the-flip-side (Aug 28, 2003)
- 4: anhaga (Aug 28, 2003)
- 5: holl (Nil Illigitaemus Carborundum) *you dont fool the hool* berty and olly: the mad raving booty shakers (oooaaa oooaaa) (Aug 29, 2003)
- 6: anhaga (Aug 29, 2003)
- 7: holl (Nil Illigitaemus Carborundum) *you dont fool the hool* berty and olly: the mad raving booty shakers (oooaaa oooaaa) (Sep 5, 2003)
- 8: ismarah - fuelled by M&Ms (Dec 1, 2003)
- 9: anhaga (Dec 2, 2003)
- 10: anhaga (Dec 2, 2003)
- 11: Tom-the-flip-side (Dec 2, 2003)
- 12: anhaga (Dec 2, 2003)
- 13: ITIWBS (Oct 24, 2008)