Conversation:

In a way it kind of vindicates things, we all thought he was living rough in a cave- willing to sacrifice for his beliefs and he then turns up living in luxury in a mansion and ends up holding a woman in front of himself as a shield before he's shot.

The man, the legend, the +w@+.

>>... we all thought he was living rough in a cave ... <<

Some people think too much ...

<< holding a woman in front of himself as a shield before he's shot.>>


No no no. According to the BBC, one of his wives threw herself heroically in front of him to protect him from the bullets.

Seriously.

Their guy actually said this on News 24. Just after he said no one was sure what happened.

There has to be big society angle for Dave to use on this..most things do these days. Might be a way to bring Muslims and non Muslims together..

The celebrations have been a bit distasteful. Two interesting essays on my links blog: http://links.xn--es-zka.info/l/reflections-on-the-death-of-osama-bin-laden/.

TRiG.

Be careful clicking links for this - especially ones claiming to be of his death - they are trojans.

Here's a fairly safe link to click - quite surprising it took them ten years to find him when he was on google maps all the time...

http://goo.gl/maps/GdFU

The 'celibration' air, that the media and polititions are trying to create surrounding his assasination is quite disgusting really. Kind of vindicates their view of 'the west' that really we're all just nasty horrible unbelievers. If the US/west's propaganda over this is meant to be working against the extremists and terrorists, then it'd seem whoever the person in charge of propaganda is, ain't doing a very good job of it The propaganda machine worked too hard to build him up into a larger than life figurehead for the extremeists and terrorists for his death to end up being anything other than a propaganda tool best suited for recruitment and furtherment of the extremists cause..

My first thought: "...and now he's a martyr."

It also bugs me that people are saying justice has been done. The way this has been done doesn't feel like justice to me, it feels like revenge. I suppose there can be a posthumous war crimes trial (can there?) but what happened wasn't 'justice'.

I don't think I disagree with taking him out rather than attempting to capture him alive and the further bloodshed that could have caused, but justice...? Mmmm.

>> quite surprising it took them ten years to find him when he was on google maps all the time...

time to cash in ££££££

stop printing che t-shirts and start churning out bin-laden t-shirts

Apparently he had a $50M price tag on his head.

That is some expensive designer turban !

will the seal team get the $50M.????????

This is a must read:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/may/03/osama-bin-laden-soviet-union-baddie

FB

"Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia"

Some good points, especially the one about Al Q directing their ire at Middle Eastern leaders, but he's wide of the mark as to why. They didn't want the dictators replaced with democratic leaders, they wanted the dictators that were pro-Western replaced with Islamist dictators.

Also, in his haste to describe Al Q as America's bogeyman, it's all too apparent that he sees the "neocons" as his own. Added in to his little jibe about America's supposed waning power it turns a fair opinion piece into ideological drivel really.

"One of the main functions of politicians – and journalists – is to
simplify the world for us." From the link provided by FB in post 34.


I suspect for some politicians it is to simplify the world for
themselves. The main purpose of politicians is to get re-elected
and to wield power. The main purpose of journalists is to make the
editors happy and to get their stories published.

"One of the main functions of politicians – and journalists – is to
simplify the world for us." From the link provided by FB in post 34.


ps: If it is in a politicians interest to make it seem more
complicated then he/she will.

"They didn't want the dictators replaced with democratic leaders, they wanted the dictators that were pro-Western replaced with Islamist dictators."

I think you have fundamentally misunderstood what he is saying here. My reading was that he was saying that *we* failed to notice that there were other people within Arab countries against the likes of Mubarak who had radically different motivations from the Islamists. And the reason we failed to notice and understand is because our "prism" of viewing the politics of the middle east was set up too narrowly.

" Added in to his little jibe about America's supposed waning power it turns a fair opinion piece into ideological drivel really."

Again on this I think you have misunderstood what he is getting at. I think what he is suggesting is that a political narrative will be constructed based on a perception of "US Waning Power" in order for it to become a political rallying point. The idea being that one can unite the society around the perception of threat from "other".

FB

FB - hmm, you may be right about the former but I stand by the latter. It seems to be de rigeur in certain media circles to accompany any opinion piece on America with a footnote that it is a declining power, a spent force. It isn't true. We're seeing other countries rise to rival the US, which is a different thing altogether.

Just as some can be accused of viewing the world through a Western prism, isn't it fair to say that the Guardian introduces it's own distortions?

For sure. But I have followed Mr Curtis's stuff for some time. He is a very interesting film maker. But a big part of what he goes on about is how political elites use constructed narratives as part of an agenda putting forward public policy.

So Communism and later Al Quida become threats to be exaggerated to build a sense of common purpose at home for the good of society. I think based on this he is suggesting that America's declining place in the world will be exaggerated and played upon as a political tool in building a political narrative to unite American political thought.

I really cannot highly recommend enough Adam Curtis' excellent film "The Power of Nightmares". People might not agree with his politics but he provides a fascinating insight into how and why the Neocon think and do what they do. Doesn't mean they are wrong but he analyses the reasons and motivations. I'd say no one has a reason to fear people analysing their beliefs. It is good to look at things critically and from different perspectives.

FB